New Class - The Warden

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merias
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Re: New Class - The Warden

Post by merias »

Thanks for your input, this is really helpful.

I looked at the combat options supplement, and I like the weapon specialization table. While the +1 bonus is simple, it does not scale with the PC level. So I think that is good to just copy as-is, and has the benefit of being a standard option.

The native/familiar/outdoor terrain distinction fits with the class being described as partrolling a known woodland area. But I don't know how it would play in practice. If the PC was part of a campaign and had a background and chosen native area, it could be easily implemented. And for an NPC Warden, the DM knows the area patrolled by the Warden is their native area. But for less fleshed-out campaigns or one-shot adventures, how would that work? It would need to be decided ahead of time what was native and what was familiar.

Percentage thief-like skills - I see this is more in line BF and B/X in general, but I never liked percentage-based skills and my own thieves use 2d6-based skills. The mechanic I used for tracking with the ability roll table comes out to about the same base percentage as in the Ranger/Paladin supplement (~45% to track at 1st level for good conditions), then increases at +1 or 5% each level. I deliberately left it vague how much bonus to apply, because conditions are so variable for something like tracking. But this mechanic could just be put in table form with percent values, and given that the other supplements do that I think it is a good idea.
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Hywaywolf
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Re: New Class - The Warden

Post by Hywaywolf »

Per the discussion about percentage skills ...

This is just my opinion, but I have always felt that if you are making a race/class/supplement to be used with BFRPG its mechanics ought to be the same as what they are for the core rules. I am not talking about when your supplement is an actual mechanics change to be used across the board for all race and classes in your game like, X in 6 Action Checks or Tiny Hit Point Companion. But if you make a class that has the tracking or thieving skill using 2d6, then you have the potential for some PCs to be using percentage and some using 2d6 for the same tasks in the same game.
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Dimirag
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Re: New Class - The Warden

Post by Dimirag »

I take the Familiar Terrain based on your text, so I thought that's what you where aiming at.

I agree with Hywaywolf, the abilities that works like thief skills or other presented class/subclass should remain mechanically unchanged unless you present the alternative rules as a supplement and tell in the class that it will make use of that alternative rules or that you present those rules in the class for other classes to use.
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Longman
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Re: New Class - The Warden

Post by Longman »

Personally, I think the animal companion HD are too high. Up to 6th level, the animal companion of the warden could easily end up having more hit points than anyone else in the party. Which, if it's a bobcat, could be a bit strange.

A dog in the core rules is 1HD, and a riding dog is 2 (so is a wolf). A dire wolf is 4.

Extra HD or hp are OK as the master progresses, but not as many, in my view.

I like the skill training ideas.
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Dimirag
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Re: New Class - The Warden

Post by Dimirag »

One option is to make it gain an extra HD per 2 levels gained after acquiring the companion. This would require 10/12 levels gained with the animal.

Other option would be to allow the animal to gain XP on its own like a retainer and its limited to half the warden's level in HD. But a table would be required for the XP cost of upgrading per HD.
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Longman
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Re: New Class - The Warden

Post by Longman »

In my current game the ranger has a dog and uses animal training. I'm going for 1HD at 1st level for the Ranger, 2 HD at 3rd, and 3 HD at 5th, and that's all. If a worg has 4HD and is 9 feet long, I can't see how a normal smaller animal could have 6HD unless it was magical.

Maybe I will add on additional hit points per level after 5th, rather than adding full hit dice.
Woe
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Re: New Class - The Warden

Post by Woe »

I don't see how a normal smaller animal could have 6HD unless it was magical.
By that argument, a 10th level Halfling fighter shouldn't have more HD than a worg. :)

I would definitely slow down on the HD progression for the companion as well. Having the pet as strong as the master would disturb game balance as well, as the warden would be 2x stronger than an equivalent PC -- double the damage per round, 2x the hp; and no equivalent penalty on the XP. Retainers are 1/2 the XP growth rate of the employer. I'd suggest the same for the companion. It'd also be worth spending a bit on starting morale of the pet as well, unless you intend for it to be fanatically devoted to the master.
Last edited by Woe on Sun Aug 24, 2014 9:17 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Freya HP 24/24 AC 16 (17 two weapons)
Kilian HP 20/20 AC 19 (18 no shield)
Talin HP 29 AC 16
Tiana HP 11 AC 12 SP 8/8
Fido HP 9/9 AC 16
Anna HP 12/12 AC 15 (19 defensively)
Bruce HP 20/20 AC 16 (15 no shield)

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Longman
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Re: New Class - The Warden

Post by Longman »

By that argument, a 10th level Halfling fighter shouldn't have more HD than a worg.
I don't really see companion animals as a full character. Especially not if it means they end up with lots more hit points than the actual humanoid characters.
Last edited by Longman on Sun Aug 24, 2014 11:55 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Dimirag
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Re: New Class - The Warden

Post by Dimirag »

What Woe said. If its a matter of size you can use the elves' HD rule.

If the animal is limited to 6HD it will have the same amount of HP range than any fighter with a +0 Con modifier. If you let the animal to increase its HD up to +6 extra HD it will end up with more HP than any fighter unless some restrictions are made.

Instead of increasing the animal's HD you can let the warden change his companion for another animal of higher HD or add more companions to a total HD value. This way you won't start the game with a cave bear but can gain one as a companion later and your dog will always remain a 1HD+1 animal.

Or... you could let the animal gain 1 or 2 hd and no more but let him add more animals later.

Having an animal companion is one of those things that must be done carefully, it can end up biting your hand
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merias
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Re: New Class - The Warden

Post by merias »

Lots of gpod comments, I'm traveling this week and can't commemt fully now. But take a look at the 1st issue of the brave the labyrinth zine (pwyw at rpgnow), that is what I based the warden's animal companions gaining HD on.
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