Class Skills ala Thief Abilities

[Hackworthy]

I've been working on an idea since my last campaign ended and I wanted to bounce it around here and get some feedback on it. I've been using the Secondary Skills supplement but I wanted to come up with something simpler but similar that would still allow each class to have some unique, largely non-combat skills, to work with. I decided giving everyone abilities similar to the Thief abilities could be an interesting way to do that. I also use the optional rule that Thief abilities are affected by ability modifiers and that will also be true for these skills. I don't have a document worked up yet as such so I hope that's okay. I just have these blurbs that I would then work into more clear and iron-clad paragraphs.

Fighter Skills

Intimidate - STR: Frighten NPCs or damage the morale of monsters

Taunt - CHA: Distract or redirect the attention of certain monsters and NPCs.

Endurance - CON: Perform feats of exceptional physical resilience.

Magic-User Skills

Lore - INT: Recall certain mundane academic knowledge or knowledge about the natural world.

Esoteric Knowledge - WIS: Recall knowledge pertaining to magic or the supernatural.

Linguistics - INT/CHA: Attempt to understand written or verbal communication in a language the character does not know /or attempt alternative forms of communication.

Cleric Skills

Prayer - CHA: Perform religious rites and ceremonies, beseech your deity for aid possibly granting minor beneficial or harmful effects depending on the nature of the deity. (I was thinking a flavorful and alternative non-spell way to access Orison effects here.)

Theology - INT: Recall knowledge pertaining to deities and their associated lore, servants, worshipers, etc...

Heal - WIS: First aid such as stopping bleeding as well as long-term care, resetting bones and so forth.

Does this seem too strong, too weak? Does it feel like it would step on Thieves' toes? I figure no since nobody gets the Thieves' specific skills and the Thief gets more of them. Thoughts?

[SmootRK]

Worthy Idea.
To go along with such an idea, I think an alternate version of the Thief (perhaps called Expert) would be cool, where such character can pick an assortment of such skills (including those essentially meant for other classes).

Some immediate suggestions to add to your list of skills, and some might be appropriate for more than one class:
Tracking (ie from Ranger in showcase "Additional Fighting SubClasses")
Disguise (from Assassin)
Poison (from Assassin)
Shadow (from Assassin)
Lore (from Bard in showcase)
Decipher (from Bard in showcase)
Tumble (from Bard in showcase)

[Hackworthy]

That's not a bad idea. I don't want people playing Thieves to feel like there's nothing special about their class and I have noted that some people don't like playing a Thief simply because they dislike the class name. They could pick up those additional skills with a point-buy system similar to the Fighter Specializations from Combat Options which I also use.

[teaman]

Another option is when using Ability checks, specify which characters are best suited for them, and having them try it (rather than skill dogpiling where someone eventually makes the roll, even if it is unlikely).

Need info on a certain cult? The cleric rolls versus Intelligence.

Lifting stuff? Fighters make the roll.

I like the original post's ideas as well, just suggesting a quick and dirty alternative as well. Saw a video on skill dogpiling and have been trying to avoid it as well.

[Hackworthy]

With everyone having essentially proprietary skills I don't think that will be an issue.

I'm working on a preliminary OpenOffice document so I can print it off and put this through the testing tonight. The Fighter and Magic-User just happen to be at my house today anyway so they can get a feel for this before we actually play.

[Dimirag]

A thing to consider is the skill development, should they all receive the same %points each level? same as a thief? depending on the amount of skills gained?

I think that Thieves should also get non-thieving skills or some other benefits, they should not be left out of a massive class improvement.

Codifying and unifying skills is something that should be carefully, as to not become a central part of the game unless that is the idea.

I would with something more general, maybe a base percentage that increase per level, roll that + ability modifier percentage for "common" skills, double the value + ability modifier percentage for "class skills", and base only (no level modifier) + ability modifier percentage for "uncommon" skills.

[Hackworthy]

Well I'm thinking I'm gonna go with Smoot's "Expert" idea. I also give Thieves the scaling sneak attack damage. I'll need to talk to my group's Thief as well. For most of my DnD career I've played Divine casters and occasionally arcane casters. Thief/Rogue is something I've literally never played. That's my worry, I don't play the class so I'm not the best person to balance it for them but I don't want them to be left out just because I don't like playing them.

Edit: Scaling is a good question, though. I'm really unsure as to whether or not the scaling should mirror the Thief skills or not.

[Hackworthy]

Forgot to come back around and put the document up. Here's the first draft. I've done a little bit of testing but not enough to make any decisions yet. I've not incorporated any suggestions yet since it's in it's infancy still but suggestions are certainly welcome.