Preparing for my first session as GM

General topics, including off-topic discussion, goes here.
User avatar
Solomoriah
Site Admin
Posts: 12449
Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2008 8:15 pm
Location: LaBelle, Missouri
Contact:

Re: Preparing for my first session as GM

Post by Solomoriah »

Boggo wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 10:49 pm so you don't pay for the additional doses, ok that's definitely a huge discount, may want to specify that I sure wouldn't have made that assumption
The rules literally say:
For each additional dose created at the same time, reduce the chance of success by 5% and increase the time required by one day.
The only mention of added costs is the next sentence:
Note that increasing the time required will directly increase the cost.
If it isn't written there, it's definitely not a rule. Nowhere else does it give an increase in cost.

NOW. Having said all that: The magic item creation rules are intentionally harsh and expensive. This is one of the places where the rules are maybe a bit harder than they need to be, to account for GMs that will "go easy" on the players (which in my experience is most of them). Well, that's one reason... the other reason is that making magic items is not meant to be the main thing adventurer magic-users are doing.

I had a player in an Arcanum game years ago who, when the opportunity came to introduce an additional character, chose a class that specialized in making certain items. He adventured a little bit, then retired to a town in the territory ruled by another player and started churning out magic for the party. It was impossible to say he couldn't just do that if he wanted; his ruler was another player, so I couldn't levy taxes directly or do other things to impede his operation, and the other players fed him cash continuously from their adventuring in return for the things he made. Keeping this to a mostly-NPC basis is the best approach in my opinion.
My personal site: www.gonnerman.org
User avatar
Boggo
Posts: 1381
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2022 7:17 pm

Re: Preparing for my first session as GM

Post by Boggo »

the way that reads to me is you are paying the same amount for every dose, not for one second did it occur to me you would only be paying once when batching, since you would need more ingredients for more output, just does not read that way at all to me. I mean you already have the advantage of saving a serious amount of time, so to me that was what the 5% failure chance was balancing, effectively making the additional doses so cheap never occurred to me.
No matter where you go...there you are
User avatar
Solomoriah
Site Admin
Posts: 12449
Joined: Thu Nov 13, 2008 8:15 pm
Location: LaBelle, Missouri
Contact:

Re: Preparing for my first session as GM

Post by Solomoriah »

Well, okay then. I've expanded the description as follows:
Note that increasing the time required will directly increase the cost, but the cost is for the entire batch, not per dose, effectively giving a discount to the cost per dose.
Is that clear enough, or do I need to say it some other way?
My personal site: www.gonnerman.org
User avatar
Boggo
Posts: 1381
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2022 7:17 pm

Re: Preparing for my first session as GM

Post by Boggo »

Solomoriah wrote: Sat Mar 04, 2023 11:20 pm Well, okay then. I've expanded the description as follows:
Note that increasing the time required will directly increase the cost, but the cost is for the entire batch, not per dose, effectively giving a discount to the cost per dose.
Is that clear enough, or do I need to say it some other way?
nope thats clear as a bell
No matter where you go...there you are
User avatar
Mars
Posts: 95
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2023 6:26 pm

Re: Preparing for my first session as GM

Post by Mars »

In any case, obviously my 30gp per dose was a pretty big blunder. :oops: And now the halfling's got 10 potions in his pack!

Oh well, there does seem to be quite a bit of poison in the Olde Island Fortress, and I've decided I'll probably use the option listed on page 152-153 of the 3rd Edition version, in which a failed Poison save results in 1d6 damage per round for 6 rounds. If someone ends up poisoned, they might be able to survive by gulping down six potions in six rounds, and that'll clear some of the excess healing potion stock. 8-)
Check out my online dice store: https://thediceking.com.
User avatar
Mars
Posts: 95
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2023 6:26 pm

Re: Preparing for my first session as GM

Post by Mars »

The rest of that fourth session saw the players returning to the dungeon through the Rabbit Hole entrance. I played the Wolf threat like I had the first time--rolling a percentile to see if the Wolves were present (they weren't). The players then returned to the room where they'd dispatched the sleeping orcs. I had three giant centipedes in the room, feeding on the orc corpses. The players nearly panicked, fighting their way back through the secret door and forcing it shut behind them, then spiking it shut (with 4 spikes!) to keep the centipedes from following. (I had the player who wanted to shut the door roll a strength check of 1 on a d6, with his strength modifier expanding the range of success to 1-3 on a d6, and he managed it.)

From there the players went back through the Rabbit Hole's other secret door. They were still so freaked out about the centipedes that they didn't want to continue down the corridor in that direction, in case the centipedes had another way out of the room, so they ended up going down the stairs to the second level of the dungeon.

They saw the gray ooze at 20--I mentioned that it looked a lot like what they'd seen through the pit trap during their first session--and killed it by throwing burning oil-flasks and daggers at it before its turn came up in initiative (which is the second time they've managed to kill something with missiles before it has a chance to act, and likely results from there being 6 people in the party that session, against one monster). Obviously, the flasks are gone, and the daggers too, because the gray ooze's acid melted them beyond use.

From there the players proceeded to room 21, which I've modified to omit the carnivorous apes and instead populate with two Crystal Living Statues. We ended the session right after the room description, though, so that encounter is how we'll start next session (planned for Wednesday, March 15th). I'm interested to see how they'll handle that encounter--seems like their greatest risk yet, with very real possibilities of character death.

Meanwhile, I'm figuring 39 XP for escaping the centipedes, and 175 for killing the ooze. Still not enough to bump them up a level, but they're getting closer.
Check out my online dice store: https://thediceking.com.
User avatar
Beowulf
Posts: 68
Joined: Sun Aug 29, 2021 1:07 am

Re: Preparing for my first session as GM

Post by Beowulf »

It will be tough even with a good fighter! Encourage caution and running away when necessary. Great adventure awaits, though! The old island fort is a gem. We've been running our game in the Morgansfort general area for almost a year and a half now. 8-)
User avatar
Mars
Posts: 95
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2023 6:26 pm

Re: Preparing for my first session as GM

Post by Mars »

Finished Session 5 last night! I think it was the most fun so far, and it's got me thinking about how collaborative the whole story-telling process can be with an RPG, and how exciting a story can be when you're combining a whole group of people's imaginations to create it.

There were certain things I put into the room sort of as potentials for the story, and then the way the players interacted with those things dictated the way the story played out.

The module description of room 21 (Large Hall) includes mention of four braziers along each side, a large unlit fireplace with an elaborate stone mantle with weird glyphs carved across it, and a large table in the middle with overturned benches and chairs around it. There are also several statues of lizard-like men, and then, of course, three carnivorous apes that attack the player characters as soon as they enter. I removed the apes and replaced the statues with just two Living Crystal Statues, described as human-like (though only with detail at the level of an Academy Award Oscar) and slightly larger than human (seven feet tall). Each statue had a pair of red gems for eyes (in homage to the cover of the 1e PH), and they were motionless when the characters entered the room, standing against the right wall, facing the table (and the large fireplace, which I positioned on the left wall).

So, table, fireplace, braziers, and statues. I knew I wanted the statues to be "activated" by a player action, but I didn't have a specific idea of what that action would be. When my players came into the room one decided to hold his torch to the nearest unlit brazier, and I used that as my triggering event. I described the brazier erupting into a column of flame, and then each subsequent brazier also igniting, in sequence. With all the braziers blazing, and the room suddenly filled with glaring light, I had the glyphs on the fireplace begin to glow vivid red, brighter and brighter with each passing moment, and the gem-eyes of the statues beginning to glow in response. The players examined the statues, touched them ("They look like smoky glass, but they don't feel cold to the touch. In fact, they feel like they're getting warmer."). One of the players decided to try to pry out one of the gems, and at that point, I had the statue turn its head to regard the offending player. And then we rolled initiative.

Now, I'd had the statue turn its head to regard the character prying at its eyes mainly because I'd been excited by the "visual" of it in my imagination. But having the statue turn to look at the character communicated to the players that the statue's used their gem-eyes to see. I hadn't specifically intended for that, but that's how the players interpreted it, and from a story point it makes good sense. Of course, if the statue can see, then it can be blinded, and that's exactly what the players wanted to make happen. The wildcard halfling managed to climb the wall and jump onto the statue, pulling an open sack over the statue's head as he did so. That meant the statue was effectively blinded, -4 to hit and +4 to being hit. They made short work of him after that.

Another of the players wanted to act on the apparent connection of the glowing glyphs and the statues' glowing eyes. He ran to the fireplace with the intention of smashing the glyph-carved mantle. But he rolled a 1. I described it as his character suffering some sort of mental block about the action, some sort of uncanny inhibition perhaps being provoked by the glyphs themselves.

Another of the characters wanted, very badly, to lasso the remaining statue, in hopes of toppling it over. In my mind these statues were too heavy and too solidly footed to be able to be pulled over. But the player persisted in the effort--apparently in her mind they were top-heavy and precariously balanced, and if that's what she got from my description then who am I to say she's totally wrong? I made her roll to see if she could manage to tie a viable knot, given the chaos and stress of the situation. She rolled well, and so I said she'd managed the knot, but that was the end of her action. Next round she threw the rope, and she had another good roll (and was only about fifteen feet away, on the far side of the table from the statue, which was engaged in melee with the dwarven fighter and the halfling), so I said she'd managed to lasso the statue's head. I let her do a strength check that same turn to see if she could have any effect, but her roll was low, so I described it as her failing to find purchase because of poor footing from the scattered glass littering the floor--the remnants of the first defeated statue. On the next turn the magic user grabbed the rope to help pull, and they both rolled pretty well, so I said they'd managed to pull the statue off balance, and it had fallen sprawling across the table. I'd made the table stone in my description because the dwarf wanted to push it and I wanted it to be way too big and heavy to push. A heavy glass statue falling forward onto a stone table seemed liable to suffer some damage, so I rolled a d6 and removed the results from the statue's hit point total. In the next round the player wanted to try to tie the rope to the table leg, so the statue would be restrained and she'd have her hands free. I had her roll another dexterity check and she rolled well, so I said she'd managed it. For the rest of that round I gave the players attack bonuses on the statue because he was prone and restrained. But at the statue's next move he rolled a strength check and managed to snap the rope and return to his feet (though he wasn't able to attack that round).

Anyway, in my initial take on the situation I'd thought the statues too heavy to topple. But the player's hadn't seen it that way. They'd persisted in their actions, they'd had clear descriptions of what they wanted to do and they'd had good dice rolls, and it resulted in an exciting story event that I probably wouldn't have come up with on my own.

So now I'm pretty excited about that potential, and I'm trying to think of other ways to provide details the players can develop into their own cool ideas.
Check out my online dice store: https://thediceking.com.
User avatar
Boggo
Posts: 1381
Joined: Thu Oct 27, 2022 7:17 pm

Re: Preparing for my first session as GM

Post by Boggo »

the single most important tool in the GM's toolkit is vivid and detailed description, then let the players run wild!
You do get them to make rolls a lot more than I would, a sufficiently well described action should more or less work in my opinion, for the lassoing the statue the only rolls I would have asked were a to hit roll to get the rope around it's neck, (though unless the character was an established rope user, like a cow herd or sailor I would have given a -3 penalty to hit). and the strength roll to topple it, but that's more a difference in style and possibly just dates me :D
No matter where you go...there you are
User avatar
Mars
Posts: 95
Joined: Sat Jan 21, 2023 6:26 pm

Re: Preparing for my first session as GM

Post by Mars »

We had session 6 on Wednesday, March 22. Here are some of the highlights:

The mage used his Sleep spell on the hobgoblins in room 22, dropping all of them except for the leader. The leader launched a desperate, hate-fueled attack on the mage, trying to cut his way through the party to get to him. The rest of the party threw themselves between the two in a frantic skirmish, cutting the hobgoblin down before he could land a blow.

One of the players decided to douse the sleeping hobgoblins in oil, so that when they slipped out of their spell-induced sleep our heroes could use that as leverage to insure a peaceful departure--"leave now or we'll light you on fire." I thought that was a pretty creative idea. But before the hobgoblins awoke, the wildcard halfling decided to start slitting their throats anyway, and the rest of the party sort of felt pressured to follow suit.

Next the party searched the room and discovered the secret door. And this lead to a lot of careful wandering through halls, searching for traps. Which I'll get back to later.

Eventually, after finding room 18 and killing the gray ooze in 17 by throwing missiles through the portcullis bars, they made their way back to the crossroads room and from there on to the Gnoll Lair. The adventure text mentions that the gnolls are "resting after a long night of debauchery," and that detail, coupled with the room's vicinity to the Large Hall--with its battered wooden table and chairs--made me envision this room as an old wine cellar, providing drinks for the feasts held in the great hall.

I put a large wine-bottle rack against the far wall, and even though the few remaining bottles of wine have all gone to vinegar now, that didn't stop the gnolls from drinking them. So the gnolls are horribly hungover, possibly mildly poisoned, and I gave them attack penalties because of it. When they missed with their attack rolls I described them seeing double, or losing their balance. Once a gnoll rolled a natural 1, and I had him puke all over himself for the fumble. When the players missed on their missile attacks, I had their daggers and sling-bullets shattering bottles left on the rack.

Even with the attack penalties, one of the gnolls hit the wildcard halfling for 8 points of damage, killing him in one stroke. I really didn't want him to die, though, so I decided to use the negative hit points option in the optional rules, and the party managed to kill the gnolls and revive the halfling.

Anyway, back to the wandering corridors I'd mentioned above. I've noticed it's happened a few times in my game where the characters wind up in long corridors without a lot of features in them. The way it looks on paper, in the maps, is very cool. But the play experience has gotten sort of less interesting for us now. I noticed a dip in the energy when the characters found their way into the secret section that includes room 23. They take actions sort of by rote--move slowly, have the thief check for traps, pause often to listen. Perhaps there are ways to keep these sections interesting? Ways I'm not thinking of?

The other thing I've been thinking is that this is our 6th session, and we've still only explored about half of the rooms in the dungeon. It's starting to feel like a mega-dungeon, even though the Olde Island Fortress is only 28 rooms. A lot of that relates to the fact that we're just doing 2-hour sessions once every other week, and we're playing online. Given that context, I'm wondering if, after finishing this adventure, it'd be wise to try to work on a smaller scale going forward. And to take an approach sort of more focused on a few specific, thematically linked encounters, instead of the exploration of a larger dungeon built by drawing a cool map.

A friend of mine mentioned the 5-room dungeon approach to me, and I've been thinking about it and wondering if it would be a good technique for short-session, online play like what my group is doing. Does anybody here have experience using the 5-room dungeon approach?

Anybody have any thoughts on how to best tailor a dungeon, or an adventure, to short-session online play?
Check out my online dice store: https://thediceking.com.
Post Reply

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: Google [Bot] and 29 guests